LIVE SESSION with Lia Kamhi-Stein
Date: Feb 9, 2009
Time: 16:00 GMT (8 am LA time)
Kamhi-Stein: How do nonnative English-speaking (NNES) teachers’ self-perceptions regarding their NNES status and their English language proficiency affect their instructional practices? And how do issues of English language proficiency and NNES status intersect with issues of professional and personal identity?
Before reading the articles for this week’s discussion, reflect on the following questions:
To what extent, if any, do your self-perceptions about your NNES status and your English language proficiency contribute to affecting (positively or negatively) your instructional practices? In turn, to what extent, if any, might your classroom behavior and practices contribute to affecting your students’ perceptions about your professional identity?
Drawing on your answers to the above questions, decide: To what extent, if any, can teachers be effective if they perceive themselves to be “deficient” or “illegitimate” speakers of professionals?
Now, read the article by Pavlenko and decide: How did the teachers’ TESOL preparation program help them develop a positive professional identity (if they did not have one)? How can you draw on the ideas in the article as a means to enhance your professional identity, thereby, contributing to affecting your instructional practices?
Now, read the abstract of the master’s thesis titled “The interrelations among accentedness, comprehensibility, intelligibility, and interpretability of nonnative English-speaking teachers from the perspectives of English as a second language students” by Taesung Kim. What does this study confirm? Why are the thesis results important for NNES educators and administrators?
Powerpoint Slides
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Live Session
Click here to listen/watch her presentation.
Below is the text chat:
Joined on February 9, 2009 at 7:53 AM
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Moderator (Session Leader): yes
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Moderator (Session Leader): i hope so
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): hi barbara
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: Hi there
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: Just got the message thru mail
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): hi barbara
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: and as I was free, thought I might drop in and see what this is all about
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: I'm in Sao Paulo
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Moderator (Session Leader): yeah, Bee, 'was scouting for people
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Moderator (Session Leader): small world. eh?
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: difficult to get people for synchronous events
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Moderator (Session Leader): right
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: Dennis Newson was complaining about it as well
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Moderator (Session Leader): and yours?
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: mine?
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Moderator (Session Leader): Ana, Bee is a long time online friend of mine
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: There's Lia
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Moderator (Session Leader): your session?
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Moderator (Session Leader): hi Lia
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: Ana...are you in Sao Paulo?
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): oh, I see! You guys are tech people
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: Hi Lia
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): hi, lia
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Moderator (Session Leader): you've got the mic
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Moderator (Session Leader): yes
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: Yes Lia
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Moderator (Session Leader): loud and clear
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Moderator (Session Leader): just chatting
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Moderator (Session Leader): pls. release the mic
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: Hi Lia
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Moderator (Session Leader): i hear Ana
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): hi terry
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Moderator (Session Leader): Ana, can you hear me?
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: Check your microphone settings Lia
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Terrymichael [undisclosed]: Hi
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): yes, i can hear lia and aiden
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: Hi Terry
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): hi karen
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: thanks! Just in time!
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: Hi Terry!
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): :0
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Terrymichael [undisclosed]: Thanks. But
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: Is this part of your EVO session, Aiden?
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Moderator (Session Leader 1):
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: Hello Barbara, nice to meet you.
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: I'm not participating in any this year...
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: Hi Karen
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: And Lia, can I get you to autograph your book?
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Moderator (Session Leader): stick around Bee
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: or organizing any for that matter...lol
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Moderator (Session Leader): you'll enjoy the discussions
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: took a real sabbatical
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Moderator (Session Leader): good for you dear
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: Hello Ana and Aiden, good morning.
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Moderator (Session Leader): Hi Karen
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: Who's who this morning?
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: Lia, are you ok?
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Moderator (Session Leader): get yourself a nice cup of coffee before we start
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): For Aiden it's earl morning
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Moderator (Session Leader): Shall we start?
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: Going to get some chocolate for dessert..shouldn't really
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: but am going anyway...lol
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Moderator (Session Leader 1) to Session Leader: aiden, should we start at 8:05?
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Moderator (Session Leader): Ana, do the honor?
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: I'm going to have chocolate ice cream for breakfast then, Bee
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Moderator (Session Leader): yes
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Moderator (Session Leader 1) to Session Leader: yes
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Moderator (Session Leader): go ahead
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Moderator (Session Leader) to LiaKS [undisclosed]: Lia, I'll help you with the slides
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Moderator (Session Leader) to LiaKS [undisclosed]: you entered here as a participant
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Moderator (Session Leader) to LiaKS [undisclosed]: not a moderator
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: wonderful..I'm not the only one to be sinning then...
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Moderator (Session Leader) to LiaKS [undisclosed]: should we start, Lia?
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Moderator (Session Leader 1) to Session Leader:
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: can hear you well
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: not even venial
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Moderator (Session Leader) to LiaKS [undisclosed]: no one is using the mic
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: it's wonderful
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Moderator (Session Leader): great to be here!
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: good stuff
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Moderator (Session Leader): right
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Moderator (Session Leader): i agree
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Moderator (Session Leader): anyone?
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: ahh... nervous!
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Moderator (Session Leader): lol
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: I got a message from Aiden, I was free and thought the topic was interesting
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Terrymichael [undisclosed]: That's important especially for novice teachers.... such as my student teachers
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: I'm doing graduate work studying NNESTs
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: and identity
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: and hiring practices
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Moderator (Session Leader): right
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Moderator (Session Leader): lol
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Moderator (Session Leader): The hills are alive...
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Moderator (Session Leader): and you still remember the date that's sweet
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]:
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Moderator (Session Leader): yes
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): yes
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LiaKS [undisclosed]: yes
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Moderator (Session Leader): lol
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LiaKS [undisclosed]: I can understand!
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LiaKS [undisclosed]: thank you!
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LiaKS [undisclosed]: anyone else!
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Moderator (Session Leader): hi bee
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Moderator (Session Leader): yes
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LiaKS [undisclosed]: yes
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): yes
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): i am glad you are here barbara
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LiaKS [undisclosed]: great!
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Moderator (Session Leader): bee is multilingual!
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: she is translinguistic!!!
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LiaKS [undisclosed]: very interesting background!
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Moderator (Session Leader): right
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: thanks, Bee
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): move ahead?
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: let's
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Terrymichael [undisclosed] 1: The reason my name is shown twice is because my student teacher is listening next to me on another computer in this workroom at Aleamny (our college)
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: great!
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: introduction?
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Terrymichael [undisclosed] 1: Sorry for the confusion. Her name is Joan.
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Moderator (Session Leader): Hi Joan
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: Hi joan
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Moderator (Session Leader): any intro from joan
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: Hello Joan
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LiaKS [undisclosed]: aiden can you switch to the next powerpoint?
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Moderator (Session Leader): slide 6
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Moderator (Session Leader): good question
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: It all depends which context you are in, I'd say
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LiaKS [undisclosed]: yes
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: a novice teacher has lots of different things to focus on, as you say
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Moderator (Session Leader): right, confidence is a big factor
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: the most difficult part for a novice teacher is all that emerges in the course of a class
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: owning English
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Moderator (Session Leader): go ahead
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): yes
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Moderator (Session Leader): yes
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: the big problem for many translinguistic teachers is that they are holding themselves up against an unrealistic ideal norm
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: a bit louder please
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Moderator (Session Leader): speak louder
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Moderator (Session Leader 1):
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]:
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Moderator (Session Leader): karen would you like to say something?
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): lia, karen has a question
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Moderator (Session Leader):
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Moderator (Session Leader): readings are here http://nnest-evo2009.pbwiki.com/Week-5
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: When I discovered I was totally deficient in all the languages I speak and that I cannot own any of them, I just relaxed
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: re-imagining the term!
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: People have being accustomed to being told in the ELT to look at the native-speaker model (an ideal non-existen universal speaker) whereas we should try to see “a native that speaks”.
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: are there any other terms that you could adopt for yourself?
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: but how about you?
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Terrymichael [undisclosed] 1: I don't think you can hear me well because I'm in school and using a not so good mic
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Terrymichael [undisclosed] 1: Joan said she couldn't hear me.
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Moderator (Session Leader): we can hear you Terry
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Terrymichael [undisclosed] 1: Oh, OK
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Moderator (Session Leader): you just need to speak a little bit luder
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Moderator (Session Leader):
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Moderator (Session Leader): sorry wrong emoticon
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: The concept of the native speaker is based on projections of one’s own language, we one see values as superior to those of others.
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LiaKS [undisclosed]: if Terry is speaking I can't hear him
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): no, he isn't
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Moderator (Session Leader): no he's not
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Terrymichael [undisclosed] 1: Yeah, Joan said she can't hear me through the earphones, eiither.
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Terrymichael [undisclosed] 1: Though she said I am speaking loudly
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): terry, could you try t type the question? we couldn't hear you. did you click the mic icon?
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Moderator (Session Leader): Bee's point aligns with Enric's argument on language and power
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: hmm... intelligibility....
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Moderator (Session Leader 1):
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Moderator (Session Leader): agree
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: how do we measure intelligibility?
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Terrymichael [undisclosed] 1: Yes, but I think this mic is old or something.
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): and I guess that being intelligible is an easier goal for our students, instead of trying to sound like a native speaker
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: intelligibility is different depending on the interlocutor?
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Moderator (Session Leader): Suresh's topic, World Englishes
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: it definitely is different
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: inside one language there are a million other languages
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: good one, Bee.
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Moderator (Session Leader): so true Bee
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Moderator (Session Leader): i move around
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: those are Excellent questions!
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Moderator (Session Leader): those are all pobrecita signs
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: have them learn a third language and observe what works and what does not
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Moderator (Session Leader): i agree
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: confidence is a problem for any novice teacher regardless language
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Moderator (Session Leader): teach them the SWOT analysis
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: SWOT is focused
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Moderator (Session Leader): that's what we should provide, Karen
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: Strenghts, Weaknesses, Opportunities and Threats
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: make them into linguists!
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: improving language skills is a continuous process
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: also depends very much on the challenges you have to face
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: especially at the advanced level, the needs are sooooo diverse, it is hard to offer a class that will hit them all!
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: agree with you that feedback is essential
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: do you have one Aiden? A language proficiency rubric?
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: videos are very useful for this..I have often used them with my students
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Moderator (Session Leader): depending on the course, yes I have
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: are you going to PUBLISH them?
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: rubrics + videos+ self and peer evaluation
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): yes, videos is a great idea
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Moderator (Session Leader): that's my thesis
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: this is sooooo good
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Moderator (Session Leader): on what grounds?
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: article use!!!!! Oh my goodness!
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Moderator (Session Leader): was the use of 'articles' an acceptable variety of her own English
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Terrymichael [undisclosed] 1: That's a common excuse..used by people in my college too
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Moderator (Session Leader): so it's an excuse
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Terrymichael [undisclosed] 1: Yes, an excuse for just wanting to protect their native speaker in group.
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: find each other, find a voice
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Moderator (Session Leader): anyone?
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: read Lia's book
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Moderator (Session Leader): right, Karen
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: That's really good, Ana
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: Own your space
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: find your space and voice
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Moderator (Session Leader 1):
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: Don't be silent
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Moderator (Session Leader): http://lc97.pbwiki.com/Project_Themes
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): aiden, I am there but there is no video
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: press play
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judytw [Judy]: watching the clip now
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Moderator (Session Leader): http://lc97.pbwiki.com/Project_Themes
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Moderator (Session Leader): this is in Mandarin
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): there is no "play" button...
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: I like the flying fish!
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LiaKS [undisclosed]: I watched it
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judytw [Judy]: wow i've never thought of this way of teaching...
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: She is teaching the months of the year... teaching completely in Taiwanese Mandarin?
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: using Mandarin sounds to teach the sounds of the months?
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LiaKS [undisclosed]: Thank you for the context
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judytw [Judy]: yes
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Moderator (Session Leader): right
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): i guess i have a slow connection; page is still downloading....
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Moderator (Session Leader): localized the topic
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Moderator (Session Leader): agree
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Moderator (Session Leader): understanding the video
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: yep, different points entirely
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Moderator (Session Leader): students sometimes discriminate teachers
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Moderator (Session Leader): and when they are discriminated they lose their confidence
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Moderator (Session Leader): in Taiwan yes
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Moderator (Session Leader): agree
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Moderator (Session Leader): not in my classes though
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Moderator (Session Leader): exactly
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Moderator (Session Leader): yes
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judytw [Judy]: Aiden is good I enjoyed the lessons you taught
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Terrymichael [undisclosed] 1: Yes, I agree!
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): yes, i think attitude is important
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: nowadays students do not believe in anything teachers say
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: lol
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judytw [Judy]: true...
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: fake it til you make it?
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Terrymichael [undisclosed] 1: But also novice teachers should know the history of NNEST issues...
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Terrymichael [undisclosed] 1: So read George's book and Lia's books
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: And Enric's!
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Terrymichael [undisclosed] 1: And Mahboob's book
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: but the confident posture should not be confused with stuborness and authoritarianism
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Moderator (Session Leader): bee, anything too much is bad
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Moderator (Session Leader): right
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): i agree
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LiaKS [undisclosed]: shall we stop here?
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Moderator (Session Leader 1) to Session Leader, Session Leader 1: aiden, do you want to close the session?
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Moderator (Session Leader): next slide?
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LiaKS [undisclosed]: okay
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Moderator (Session Leader): students are bluffing
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: nice discussion developed here http://dekita.org/weblog/native-teachers-or-non-native-teachers
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: discrimination is key here
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Moderator (Session Leader): get lia's book!
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Terrymichael [undisclosed] 1: Thank you very much, Lia.
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bdieu [Barbara (Bee)]: Thank you Lia, Aiden and Ana..nice to have met you all
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Moderator (Session Leader): asynchronous discussions
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Terrymichael [undisclosed] 1: And also Ana and Aiden!!!!!
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: THANK YOU!!!!
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LiaKS [undisclosed]: Thank you All!
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Moderator (Session Leader 1) to Session Leader, Session Leader 1:
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judytw [Judy]: Thanks a lot for all the preparation and the presentation!
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Moderator (Session Leader): have a nice day, Lia!
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Moderator (Session Leader 1):
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): yes, i will
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): have a great day
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Moderator (Session Leader): bye
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Karen.Rauser [Karen]: bye all!
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Moderator (Session Leader): stopped recording
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Moderator (Session Leader 1): bye karen
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Moderator (Session Leader): gnight everyone!
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References
Teacher Preparation and Nonnative English Speaking Professionals
Kim, T. (2007). The interrelations among accentedness, comprehensibility, intelligibility, and interpretability of nonnative English-speaking teachers from the perspectives of English as a second language students. Unpublished masters’s thesis. CaliforniaStateUniversity, Los Angeles.
Pavlenko, A. (2003). “I never knew I was a bilingual”: Reimagining teacher identities in TESOL. Journal of Language, Identity, and Education, 2(4), 251-268.
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